I’ve just start working with CP, so I asked my local WP community how they think about CP.
Several of my local community members are not very pleased with CP (yet).
There are already 2 versions of CP (where does this end?)
Many themes and plugins from WP are or become outdated / unusable, mainly because of the block editor, but CP still uses the WP repository as its main source
They use WP but don’t give back to its community
Especially that last one keeps bugging me…
What are your thoughts about this? Is this true, or not?
I don’t understand this one. After all, there are over 60 versions of WP! The point is that, unlike WordPress, ClassicPress uses semantic versioning. That means that our version numbers don’t just go up in tenths. Each part of the number means something. So a change to the number before the first dot indicates that there were some breaking changes (specifically to enable CP v.2 to use more themes and plugins in the WP repository).
Anyone thinking of switching to CP should be switching to version 2+. The number after the first dot indicates an update without breaking changes. We are currently on 2.3+ and we don’t envision releasing a version 3 for quite some time.
This is just wrong. The main source of themes and plugins for ClassicPress is the ClassicPress Directory.
Again, this is just wrong. Members of the core team have actually submitted PRs and bug reports to WordPress. One of the most recent concerned the actual build process for WP, which had a major issue. How did we discover that? Because we came across it in CP!
Welcome Guido. With no disrespect, but your statements seem just personal. I’m not sure why you have an inherent anger towards ClassicPress?
As an agency owner using WordPress since 2010, ClassicPress, and spending thousands (if not tens of thousands) in the WordPress ecosystem, I take absolute exception to about every point you make here:
Completely wrong. All software goes through updates and changes over time. Joomla, Drupal, Windows, iOS ,WordPress or whatever. Like any software, ClassicPress is also updated over time. Have you ever looked at how many versions of WordPress there are?
It doesn’t matter what software you use - you should always be using the current version
Not really. ClassicPress Directory is the main source for themes and plugins. However ClassicPress does have compatibility with WordPress - at least for now. And that is a bonus in my opinion.
That’s just insulting. Over the years, I’ve supported WordCamp, hired college students and contractors for WordPress development, paid thousands of dollars for plugins and themes, hired WordPress developers etc. Even used WordPress as a platform for small business, corporations, and even a union.
How is that not giving back?
That’s fine if you don’t like the idea or want to use ClassicPress. But at least have some understanding of FAQs before you post.
Thanks. To be clear, it’s not my intention to speak bad about CP, just writing down the feedback I got from my local community.
I may be mistaken, but there are 2 versions of CP and I thought you could not simply update a V1 to a V2, because you need to run a migration?
If you want to add a new theme or plugin, the WP repository is displayed in the admin. So it gives me the impression that’s the “official” one.
It might be a good idea to promote the CP repository there as well. Or to integrate it there, somehow.
Understood! Great to hear it’s not a one-way street
Thanks for your reply.
You’re mistaken about me being against CP. That’s not true at all. Your post and my reply to Tim where added almost simoustanly: To be clear, it’s not my intention to speak bad about CP, just writing down the feedback I got from my local community.
Because I did not find the answer to these questions (after a quick search, I admit) I decided to post here.
The reason we don’t add a nag to update from version 1 to version 2 is that, as I explained about semantic versioning, there are breaking changes. We want users to realize that; we don’t want to nag them to update and cause them to break something, and then panic (which is what sometimes happens with WP). This is one of the reasons for using semantic versioning.
At some point, we will probably add this to core. At the moment, though, we are updating it more regularly than core as we improve it and add new features, so the update cycles don’t mesh.
Thanks for clarifying the reasons behind using multiple versions.
As for the ClassicPress Directory Integration plugin, I (clearly) did not know about this plugin. Have installed it and now I can install CP plugins / themes easily. Thanks for that.
Please take into consideration that I’m a CP newbie, and at first I was expecting a WP clone without the block editor. But it’s a lot more than that. Things are different and users who come from WP have to get used to it.
Reading this just delivered a clarifying thought for me.
I think that in its origins, ClassicPress was WordPress without the Block Editor, but that’s not the case anymore and hasn’t been for quite some time (perhaps since the release of v2.
I believe that WordPress has fully embraced deep JavaScript utilisation, React now powers the Editor, Full Site Editing, Reusable Blocks, Themes, Patterns and all of the new site editing tools created within the WordPress ecosystem.
When ClassicPress chose to create a fork it followed a different route; the project remained focussed more on the established PHP core and most recently has taken to simplifying and modernising the JavaScript in a vanilla way, rather than via ESNext, webpack and complex building and packing steps.
That for me is the fundamental difference between WordPress and ClassicPress now, at the coding level at least.
@Guido07111975
Fair enough. I wasn’t aware of the v1 to v2 differences either, as I had not used CP for a couple years in-between. So that helps to clarify a point for me as well.
It was the title of your article “Giving back to WP” that caught my attention, and especially your third point “… use WP but don’t give back to its community.” That was just out of context to any other points about CP I’ve ever heard over the years.
A statement like that is hard to take for people such as myself who have invested a lot of money into the WP ecosystem over the years. But its also hard to take for those who have put a lot of time into coding WordPress itself, core, plugins and themes. Many of whom are here in the CP community as well - a statement like that also undermines their hard work.
I don’t think that was your intent but that is the way it came across (at least for myself). So apologies for my terse response.
Regarding the feedback I’ve received from the business community - it’s more basic than all of that. They just don’t see the point to CP. Until their sites run 3-4x faster, they don’t have to disable Gutenberg with extra plugins, and they have the familiar editor they are used to. Then they get it.
But as @MattyRob points out, there is much more to CP than just that. One day WP will be fully vested into that React framework with blocks, and that point what do you do? Either you embrace it or you don’t…
I’ve looked at WordPress alternatives over the years, Drupal, Joomla, Concrete CMS, Webflow, you name it. But I keep coming back to ClassicPress.
Absolutely not intended, I was just interested in how CP-users think about the feedback I got. English is not my native language, so it could have come across as a bit blunt.
Today I found this similar topic, I’m pretty certain the replies there will give me more context and (background) info as well.
Thanks, great to hear (read) that mostly normal JS is being used.
I have developed a couple of WP plugins and had to ask for help while adding support for blocks, because my React knowledgde was not “deeply”, to say the least. I know, that’s on me, but nonetheless it’s great to hear that all those other languages / libraries are not being used in CP.
I’ve been thinking about the third point above since readings the original post and I wonder where this belief comes from and also if / how to challenge it.
So, for my own personal perspective, I will accept that I do not participate in the social channels and discussions about WordPress, but I currently have 5 open issues in the WordPress trac system, 4 open issues and 1 open PR on the Gutenberg repository and my name was also listed as a contributor on the last major release of WordPress - 6.7,
So, what is meant by the statement that ClassicPress doesn’t give back? Is that a statement about money? Is it time supporting and developing? Is it deeply participating in the WordPress core? Or is it just an accepted ‘fact’ that in reality isn’t true but is not challenged?
We are busy developing ClassicPress, but if we find something that applies to WordPress we share it back.
I think it’s probably none of those things really. I suspect it’s nothing more than pub gossip.
One or two people might have said it without actually bothering to check, and the reason it came up is probably (a) because of Matt Mullenweg’s complaint about WP Engine, and (b) because they’ve been whining about the need to leave WP but yet want to somehow rationalize their failure to do that. (Moaning about something while doing nothing about it is a common behavior!)
Of course, it might be that others have now repeated this falsehood of not giving back. But it will all soon get forgotten, especially as Matt M himself has recently been very vocal in supporting the idea of forks of WP.
Yes, I think you’re right Tim! Lack of knowledge about CP and its community. I just wanted to know how CP users think about this. That’s the (only) reason for posting this. I feel reassured
Another note on plugins and themes would be that WPorg still has a lot of stuff that is compatible with CP, and even more that can be patched to work pretty easily. Point being, I hope over time devs will make an effort to add to the CP directories, but also that people will potentially fork and add many of those WPorg utilities to the CP directory. At least in the short term the fact that CPv2 is pretty friendly with WP stuff just makes it easier to switch.
Are many people hung up on these rumors and old info, causing them to repeat such information and/or be reluctant to migrate? My personal opinion is that if you just take the step and convert, it only gets easier after that.
The only WP sites I have left are for testing that my stuff still works with WP…
I’m planning to move 2 WP shops (both use WC) to another hosting provider, but still reluctant to migrate to CP (with ClassicCommerce) at the same time. Also, are the additional WC-related plugins compatible? Guess it’s time for another test install and find out. But I’m getting off-topic… So will create another topic when having (more) questions about this.
